Gods Why

Fun fact: Halo Wars is incredibly popular among the Halo fanbase, even among fans who I respect for their taste.

Remember the people who rode the Halo 2 Hype Wave and were disappointed with the results? Yeah, that's us.

Wait, Rot, do you still have your "how to implement the Flood" post saved? Go post that on the 343 Forums, maybe someone marginally intelligent will see it this time.

Rasq'uire'laskar wrote:Fun fact: Halo Wars is incredibly popular among the Halo fanbase, even among fans who I respect for their taste.

But why? The writing was awful. The plot was awful. The mechanics were awful. The AI was awful. The multiplayer was awful. What redeeming quality did Halo Wars have that would inspire popularity? Was it just a case of baby's first RTS where a bunch of people were like "this strategy thing is pretty neat" because they'd never played an actual strategy game before?

Rasq'uire'laskar wrote:Remember the people who rode the Halo 2 Hype Wave and were disappointed with the results? Yeah, that's us.

Bah, I was only disappointed that Halo 2 lacked a proper ending, and I'm pretty sure that was the general consensus of the entire population at the time. Of course, I didn't get to ride the Halo 2 hype train, because I didn't really come into being a Halo fan until after its release. I didn't realize Bungie had promised the moon for Halo 2 and delivered some moon rocks until much much later.

But I rode the fuck out of the Halo 3 hype train and was ultimately pretty happy with the game. And that was at the peak of my lore mastery, when I was most able to be critical.

You know... 5 years is a long time. A lot of things have happened to me in the time I wrote this and me as I type this now. I got two degrees, had some fun times and had some pretty dark days. I moved away from my home and I have a full-time job in a research lab.  As such I feel my interests and priorities have changed a lot. I stop caring about Halo after Reach and my taste in games have really shifted away from the shooters I played so readily back then. I honestly got over the game. But I'd be remiss if I didn't talk about this, as the first game and the the fallout from it was a big thing back then, so I'll give my thoughts about this new game.

Now I think I made it clear both in my early impressions when I got the demo early (Cos I was in the canned Alpha, Thanks Dud) and at launch 6 years ago and the following years following it, I had a pretty strong opinion on the game, as I was not shy to point out the problems the game had. Hell, I played the multiplayer and got to General back when getting to General actually meant something (Back when it was 3.4 million points or something ridiculous) before they dropped it and still kept going. I can confidently say I have probably played more of that one game than anybody else on this forum combined.

Now I'm sure after all that set-up you're saying to yourself "Well Vigil, It's nice to go through that stuff we all know again, but I know you probably hate this idea and will rant about it right?" Well this is the part where you understand why I started with that old screenshot and the importance of shifting and changing opinions over time. I know some people on this forum have real trouble understanding that pulling out things I said several years ago may not accurate reflect my view in 2015, and what I said at the time was said based on what I knew and felt about the subject at that moment. Opinions are weird like that.

Now with that said; to the topic at hand. What do I think about the idea of a Halo Wars 2? I am completely neutral about it, but I have no issue with them having another crack at the idea, because I did see some potential in the original that given the right circumstances could be a good game.

As I expect half of you are now running to your keyboards right now, writing 3 page diatribes about how I'm completely wrong and I should hate it as a concept because of how bad it got fucked up first time round, and clearly 343 industries (Who for the record I have no real love for) is the embodiment of lazy developers who destroyed the canon of Halo and the last good game was Halo 3, hold off for a second and re-read what I said.

See that part where I said I was neutral? Why did I say that? Simple really, as essentially the only link this has to original is the name and probably the story. The developer of the original died midway through development (Which is partially why it came out as it did) and we now have another studio who has never touched this IP, basically a fresh start in terms of the creative team behind it. Now they may completely suck at it and make as much of a botched job as Ensemble did, and Creative Assembly has quite the reputation of nightmarishly buggy launches, so I have taken that into consideration, just as took the fact they made Alien Isolation; a genre on a platform they have never done before and made arguably the definitive Alien game. In my mind at this early stage I see it going either way honestly.

"But what about the story? Red team was in the teaser and 343 can't write for shit so that will suck!"

Now you'll be happy to know that 6 years later I still think Halo Wars story whether you factor in Canon or not was completely fiery shit. Do I think 343 will better this time? Probably not. Halo 4 wasn't that great, but I'll give credit where credit is due, at least they're trying to add some personality (Whether you like it or not) to their protagonists, and given the absolute nothing we got for Red team last time, anything would be an improvement. Hell given the quality of story telling in RTS as a genre overall over the last few years, my expectations are at rock bottom. You did see that fucking mess Blizzard called Heart of the Swarm's Campaign right?

There was nothing good about HW's gameplay, it was a complete failure!  Why do you say it had potential?

I'm glad you asked. Because despite the mess that was socket bases, atrocious pathfinding I despise with the heat of a thousand suns, heavily unbalanced factions and lazy leader powers, there were a few things I actually liked. First off the control scheme. I got my start in the RTS genre on the console and have since moved on to bigger and better things on PC, but from my experience, Halo Wars had the best controls for an RTS on a console period. So much so future games started stealing and for good reason. It made controlling units and quickly managing the base and units very simple and it had a enough depth for a bit of micro and macro.

Did you fuckers know if you held down the move button and kept doing it a few times you could set a patrol route? It's little things like that if somebody who had more time and love you could really do something with.  I also think the idea of the UNSC and the Covenant (Or even Flood, as we all saw a decent write up of what that could potentially be) as differentiated RTS factions still holds merit and could be done in the right hands.

Again I'll point out what I said is completely speculative and given the prior attempt I doubt any of that will reach what I'd want and probably be as busted as the last game.

To conclude, to bring this full circle and my point about opinions. At this present point and time we have nothing to go on. I base this opinion on the fact that I have made it on the current information available given how fucking bad Halo Wars was against what a potential game it could be. Essentially it has come down to my view in games in general nowadays; could be good, could be bad due to industry track records and bullshit.

I will wait and see and make an informed educated opinion about it when it is out and people I trust have had time to play it to form a consensus. In the meantime, I'm sure my opinion will morph and change over time. It has over the last 6 years and I see no reason why it won't in the following year. I could be completely wrong about it, or dead right, It's absolutely up to conjecture right now. I may be aboard the S.S. Hate Train in 3 months, may not be. I guess we'll see.

I pretty much agree with you there Vigil, except maybe with a little more hope and optimism thrown in there since it'll have a PC version this time.

But maybe the dreams will get crushed once again, we'll see

Still only ever played like 2 rounds of the Beta lol.

Maybe I should go pick it up and play it finally. Only been like 6 years.

Lord Pheonix wrote:Still only ever played like 2 rounds of the Beta lol.

Maybe I should go pick it up and play it finally. Only been like 6 years.

Campaign isn't really worth playing, it's fairly dull. I wouldn't bother getting it unless you have a 360 and a Gold sub to play MP. That can be kind of fun sometimes, but it's basically just spamming one unit until you win.

I thought they shut down MP for Halo Wars?

Felix wrote:I thought they shut down MP for Halo Wars?  

Did they?

Damn, heard the announcement and thought of the old Halo Wars Forum and you guys. Nostalgia trip jesus. As for the game, I really don't care.

UKURSE

Mr.Inferior of the two Admins wrote:  UKURSE

Mr.Inferior of the two Admins wrote:

Don't be sad brother, I was only kidding!

If this news acts like a beacon that gets the site back together, it'll almost be worth it.

Lets all go back in time to the good ol' days

you know, we should all get the game just so we can all play together again

Since it's PC i'll.....obtain a copy to play.

I may or may not procure the game in a slightly-less-than-legal manner.

or we could all play a good game

we should start a steam group

Still waiting on that Civ 5 game...

Just played earlier today

Mr.Inferior of the two Admins wrote:or we could all play a good game

we should start a steam group

1v1 sf mid

Mr.Inferior of the two Admins wrote:or we could all play a good game

we should start a steam group

You idiots already have a steam group. 2 of them I might add.

https://steamcommunity.com/groups/TheCrimsonFlame

https://steamcommunity.com/groups/TCFcrimsonflame

Vigil wrote:

Mr.Inferior of the two Admins wrote:or we could all play a good game

we should start a steam group

You idiots already have a steam group. 2 of them I might add.

https://steamcommunity.com/groups/TheCrimsonFlame

https://steamcommunity.com/groups/TCFcrimsonflame

Third group is the charm.