And The Pirates Strike Back

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Post by KristallNacht on Wed May 13, 2009 9:09 pm

So, The Pirate Bay has determined a way to actually use entirely legal methods to completely bankrupt the law firm representing the music industry against them.

http://www.blogpirate.org/2009/05/10/pirate-bay-founder-crafts-distributed-denial-of-dollars-attack/
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Post by Gold Spartan on Wed May 13, 2009 11:37 pm

Damm clever bastards.
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Post by Toaster on Thu May 14, 2009 4:25 am

Clever indeed. I do, however, doubt that this will effect anything other than the legislative views towards TPB. Seriously, bankrupting the lawfirm isn't going to free them from anything.
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Post by Untamed Reign on Thu May 14, 2009 4:43 am

Wowww.

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Post by thane321 on Thu May 14, 2009 5:22 am

wow, spoilt child much?
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Post by Cheese on Thu May 14, 2009 5:34 am

thane321 wrote:wow, spoilt child much?

Pretty much what I was about to say, only better worded. No way they're gonna allow this.

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Post by thane321 on Thu May 14, 2009 6:05 am

Cheese wrote:
thane321 wrote:wow, spoilt child much?

Pretty much what I was about to say, only better worded. No way they're gonna allow this.

better worded?

it's straight to the point and undersandable, what more do you need?
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Post by CivBase on Thu May 14, 2009 6:22 am

ROFL

Who cares about the war on terror? This one's far more entertaining!

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Post by KristallNacht on Thu May 14, 2009 8:44 am

Cheese wrote:
No way they're gonna allow this.

not allow this?

how can they not? its perfectly legal.

ReconToaster wrote:Clever indeed. I do, however, doubt that this will effect anything other than the legislative views towards TPB. Seriously, bankrupting the lawfirm isn't going to free them from anything.

really, it either changes nothing, or removes the fine. If the company does in fact go bankrupt, the fine no longer has a recipient and thus does not need to be payed.
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Post by Cheese on Thu May 14, 2009 9:28 am

KristallNacht wrote:
Cheese wrote:
No way they're gonna allow this.

not allow this?

how can they not? its perfectly legal.


Yeah I just mean something will probably be done to prevent it. Something also legal.

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Post by KristallNacht on Thu May 14, 2009 9:34 am

I cant think of anything aside from just straight up not allowing the transfer of money.
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Post by RX on Thu May 14, 2009 10:04 am

Good boys ^^
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Post by Toaster on Thu May 14, 2009 11:32 am

KristallNacht wrote:I cant think of anything aside from just straight up not allowing the transfer of money.

What will happen, is this lawfirm will find that the pirate bay conspired against them, and take THEM to court AGAIN. The pirate bay guys have been successfully prosecuted for doing perfectly legal things before. It can very well happen again.

There is such a thing as fraud, or, in this case, conspiracy of fraud. They're not invincible.
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Post by CivBase on Thu May 14, 2009 1:10 pm

And then what will they do, RT? Fine them again?

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Post by Rasq'uire'laskar on Thu May 14, 2009 1:39 pm

CivBase wrote:And then what will they do, RT? Fine them again?
Hopefully something much more dire. Consiracy to commit fraud, if I remember correctly, carries jail time in a few European countries.
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Post by Toaster on Thu May 14, 2009 2:57 pm

CivBase wrote:And then what will they do, RT? Fine them again?

They could of course, you know, change their payment system. Maybe they could higher someone to approve payments... or more simply, make it a requirement to pay in increments ABOVE 1 ISK?


It's really not that complicated...
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Post by CivBase on Thu May 14, 2009 4:22 pm

They're not going to just give in like that.

If they do the "increments ABOVE 1 SIK" then they'll just barely go above that and the fine will still have hardly any value. Besides, there's no law against what they've done. No ex post facto.

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Post by Toaster on Thu May 14, 2009 5:28 pm

CivBase wrote:They're not going to just give in like that.

If they do the "increments ABOVE 1 SIK" then they'll just barely go above that and the fine will still have hardly any value. Besides, there's no law against what they've done. No ex post facto.

There is no law SPECIFICALLY against exactly what they are doing, but as I said, there is such a thing as conspiracy to fraud, and that IS illegal. That is EXACTLY what Peter Sunde is doing.

Also, note that this has NOTHING to do with 'paying the fine.' The fine that TPB has been issued cannot be paid through the law firm's online donation box. The pirate bay guys aren't doing this to pay the fee whilst taking down the law firm. They state RIGHT THERE in the article that they don't intend to pay it. They are asking OTHERS to pay small amounts to the law firm, so that it may go out of business before TPB is forced to pay up.

If the site initiated a 'above 1 SEK' policy, they could avoid being fucked by the storm Sunde is brewing, and , being that the law firm would still exist, Sunde would have to pay up.
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Post by CivBase on Thu May 14, 2009 6:43 pm

Unless they come up with something else lol

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Post by KristallNacht on Thu May 14, 2009 9:52 pm

ReconToaster wrote:

What will happen, is this lawfirm will find that the pirate bay conspired against them, and take THEM to court AGAIN. The pirate bay guys have been successfully prosecuted for doing perfectly legal things before. It can very well happen again.

There is such a thing as fraud, or, in this case, conspiracy of fraud. They're not invincible.

well lets see.

The charges already held against them that they were convicted of are possibly gonna be thrown out due to bias on one of the judges parts before the trial began.

Also, fraud is defined as:
1. A deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain.
2. A piece of trickery; a trick.
3.
a. One that defrauds; a cheat.
b. One who assumes a false pose; an impostor.


None of which apply to this situation. In essence, they are merely paying the fine, by using their supporters. 30million people send 1 SEK and the fine is paid. Except the law firm ends up -29,998,000 SEK.

And the fact that the lawfirm can't even take piratebay operators to court about it anyway, as none of them live in Sweden anymore.
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Post by KristallNacht on Thu May 14, 2009 9:54 pm

ReconToaster wrote:Sunde would have to pay up.

Not really. Very few non INTERPOL countries would extradite to Sweden. Thus they would all become real pirates running from the law and not able to enter certain countries.
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Post by Rasq'uire'laskar on Thu May 14, 2009 11:08 pm

KristallNacht wrote:
Also, fraud is defined as:
1. A deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain.

KristallNacht wrote:None of which apply to this situation. In essence, they are merely paying the fine, by using their supporters. 30million people send 1 SEK and the fine is paid. Except the law firm ends up -29,998,000 SEK.
ReconToaster wrote: Also, note that this has NOTHING to do with 'paying the fine.' The fine that TPB has been issued cannot be paid through the law firm's online donation box. The pirate bay guys aren't doing this to pay the fee whilst taking down the law firm. They state RIGHT THERE in the article that they don't intend to pay it. They are asking OTHERS to pay small amounts to the law firm, so that it may go out of business before TPB is forced to pay up.

KristallNacht wrote:And the fact that the lawfirm can't even take piratebay operators to court about it anyway, as none of them live in Sweden anymore.
The solution.
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Post by KristallNacht on Fri May 15, 2009 2:03 am

Rasq, whether they said they're going to pay or not is irrelevant.

and like it says. GAIN. The pirate bay has nothing to really 'GAIN'.
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Post by BBJynne on Fri May 15, 2009 7:42 am

Rasq'uire'laskar wrote:The solution.

This needs to happen more.

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Post by Toaster on Fri May 15, 2009 10:46 am

Really NT, because the definition I read said that 'In criminal law, fraud is the crime or offense of deliberately deceiving another in order to damage them.'

The fine is not payable through the Lawfirm's onnline donation box. It doesn't work that way. This payment is COMPLETELY unrelated.

and Yes, I'd say contract killing would be the perfect solution. I'd be willing to pay extra for torture.
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