Re: Philosophical Discussion Thread

[tiny tim]

Okay, bugger. I had written an entire rebuttal to your comment then clicked the Back button on my mouse.

Have a read here: http://www.google.com.au/search?q=hard+determinism&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a

That'll give you an idea, and a clearer summary of what I have been trying to say.

Do you know what you have just done!?!?!?! YOU HAVE TRIGGERED ONE OR ROT'S GREAT MULTI-QUOTES OF DOOM! He will spend the rest of the day reading that and rereadding it and then quote every spot in it disproving it all! Everyone, except Ziggy, in the shelter NAO!

*enters mega multi-quote fallout shelter*

[Zaki90]

Okay, bugger. I had written an entire rebuttal to your comment then clicked the Back button on my mouse.

Have a read here: http://www.google.com.au/search?q=hard+determinism&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a

That'll give you an idea, and a clearer summary of what I have been trying to say.

You are screwed now. Never ever do that. You should fear the might of his uber muliquotes. I still remember the How to Implement the Flood one that took me 2 hours to read.

[tiny tim]

Zaki! Get in the shelter!

[Rotaretilbo]

If we're going to argue that free will does not exist simply because of time, then I shall whip out String theory, bitches. For while time is the fourth dimension, chance is the fifth and choice is the sixth. While you or I may perceive time as a straight line, that is simply because, as three-dimensional beings, we are incapable of perceiving dimensions above time. Simply put, I want you to imagine the first three dimensions: width, length, and height. Now, when you put those all together, you get space. So a 3D area is space. Now, the next three dimensions are similar. When you put time, chance, and choice together, you get another 3D area, which I will refer to as life for lack of a better word.

So, in a way, there is no free will, because every possibility that could ever happen from our starting conditions is just a point in a 6D graph. However, what we experience is determined by free will. While there are other points on the 6D graph, infinitely so, the only true reality is the one we experience, and for that to be so, free will must exist in order for us to affect things on the sixth dimension: choice. Theoretically speaking, if we were to bend the sixth dimension through the seventh, we could actually ourselves go to an alternate reality in which things have changed. However, this dimension would only exist for as long as we were there, because it is not the true reality.

That aside, and back to determinism, I thought of a few other inconsistencies. Memory loss. Subconsciously, we never lose any of our memories, but consciously, we do. Therefore, how can memory loss affect our judgement and actions if we decide everything subconsciously?

[tiny tim]

No multi-quote? THANK YOU GREAT ROTARETILBO!

[Rotaretilbo]

What was I going to multiquote? A google search?

[tiny tim]

the wikipedia page.

[Zaki90]

We are saved!

[Kasrkin Seath]

Time is more of a concept itself to begin with...

[kslidz]

If we're going to argue that free will does not exist simply because of time, then I shall whip out String theory, bitches. For while time is the fourth dimension, chance is the fifth and choice is the sixth. While you or I may perceive time as a straight line, that is simply because, as three-dimensional beings, we are incapable of perceiving dimensions above time. Simply put, I want you to imagine the first three dimensions: width, length, and height. Now, when you put those all together, you get space. So a 3D area is space. Now, the next three dimensions are similar. When you put time, chance, and choice together, you get another 3D area, which I will refer to as life for lack of a better word.

So, in a way, there is no free will, because every possibility that could ever happen from our starting conditions is just a point in a 6D graph. However, what we experience is determined by free will. While there are other points on the 6D graph, infinitely so, the only true reality is the one we experience, and for that to be so, free will must exist in order for us to affect things on the sixth dimension: choice. Theoretically speaking, if we were to bend the sixth dimension through the seventh, we could actually ourselves go to an alternate reality in which things have changed. However, this dimension would only exist for as long as we were there, because it is not the true reality.

That aside, and back to determinism, I thought of a few other inconsistencies. Memory loss. Subconsciously, we never lose any of our memories, but consciously, we do. Therefore, how can memory loss affect our judgement and actions if we decide everything subconsciously?

agian rot

even in the string theory ( i personally believe to be bullshit) there are infinite lines and parallel universes that are happening and while there are an infinite amount of possibilities of different universes we could be in
we arent in multiple universes and we do not cross into them
so
the path we are on is complete and wont change even if there are an infinite amounts of universes around us
we are in one universe that universes time is determined by the very nature of time

now on to why i think the string theory is shit
simply and not logically (although not illogically) I believe God exists and has A pan not infinite ones

[Kasrkin Seath]

that made no sense kslidz

[Gauz]

that made no sense kslidz

[kslidz]

prove one part either illogical or wrong

thats the worst argument ever


"that made no sense"

really come up with something

[Angatar]

God has a pan? What the hell does he need that for? Are we going to be made into pancakes?

[Zaki90]

God has a pan? What the hell does he need that for? Are we going to be made into pancakes?

God is a cannibal isn't he.

[tiny tim]

This conversation is making me glad I am agnostic.

[Gauz]

What version of determenism are we focusing on? The determenism I read was based more on external forces determening your future, rather your subconci. I really didn't read much on your subconcious mind controlling your actions.

[Ziggy]

New topic:

What is the meaning of life?

[Gauz]

The meaning of life for a individual or the purpose life even exists?

[tiny tim]

The purpose of life is the propagation of the species.

[Angatar]

To die.

[BBJynne]

To die.

Alone, in the rain

[Angatar]

To die.

Alone, in the rain

Better yet, alone in a dumpster.

[BBJynne]

But that's kinda a success story. Dying in the rain is depressing.

[Angatar]

It's raining while you're in the dumpster.

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